- March 29, 2016 at 1:53 am #26541
Hoping to finally develop a load for a rifle queen that I purchased along time ago. I have been gearing up for and hoping to find a load that makes me smile. I haven’t messed with the trigger, still doing some reading, as my understanding is I may be able to adjust from what feels like a 7lb pull.
With H4895, and the 30XCB I believe I should be looking at around 1800-1950fps? I based this off of other posts and questions I’ve asked in the past. The charge weight for this starts around 28grs and goes up to 40grs ( don’t have my manuals in front of me but know thats close. With a spread this far apart what should I load to narrow that down? I believe in 10shot strings, but thats a lot of components to be throwing down range. Was thinking of finding the 1900fps load with Chrony and back off then develop from there.
To find my C.O.A.L. I just used the old method of cleaning rod to bolt face measurement taken from boolit held in place for 2.950″.
Looking for suggestions on were to start with powder charges, how many rounds per string, etc…?
1968 Winchester Model 70 30-06 all factory ( second rifle purchased 24+yrs ago, and probably haven’t put 200 rnds down the pipe)
Nikon 3X9X40 Buckmaster
NOE 30XCB 162gr naked sorted and weighed +/- 0.2gr , 2500+lube, Gator GC, sized .3105
Greek once fired brass sorted by weight
Winchester Lg rifle primer
- March 29, 2016 at 10:25 am #26545chutesnreloadsParticipant
- Posts: 4
- Comments: 161
- Overall: 165
Everyone has their own methods.Way I do it is load up batches of 5 cartridges with the same charge starting at the low end of your load recipe.I make 5 shot groups working up each group in half grain increments.I keep each group labeled with the load and distance to target.Different colored markers help by getting 2-3 groups per target and can still see which is what but I NEED to label after every shot string to be sure I don’t mix up holes.Used to save targets in a notebook.Now I take a picture of them and save it in a loads section on the ‘puter.Looking for best groups,work up until at the highest end of the recipe or groups start getting bigger or get high pressure signs.You may get more than one promising load.I then load up batches of 10 of the promising loads and retest until satisfied it is a good repeatable load.KEEP RECORDS!These will surely be useful in future.Others will chime in with ladder methods and such.Up to you how you go about it.Only wrong way is to start at the highest loads.Anyway.that’s the way I do it.Did I say KEEP RECORDS!?
- March 29, 2016 at 11:25 am #26547
I’m on board with with every thing you say. I guess with this huge spread from min to max loading I would end up with 24+different charges increasing in 0.5gr increments. Take that times 5 and I now have 120 rnds to test.
Was thinking just test in 1gr increments or as you mentioned do a latter test to find a group….now you have me remembering some stuff. thanks!
- March 29, 2016 at 1:19 pm #26550uber7mmParticipant
- Posts: 17
- Comments: 288
- Overall: 305
I usually start off with 3 grain increments, from low end to high end. I then bracket the best grouping in 1 grain increments in a second test, repeating the best group’s charge as a control. Then depending on the application, a .1 grain incremental test. I keep primers, case length and COAL as constants.
Here’s a tip that I’ve found useful:
I write the powder charge on the case with a sharpie ink pen during the powder charging process. That way if I do mix the box of cartridges up, (and it does happen occasionally), I can still continue the testing. After initial examination of each empty case and primer for anomalies, I wipe the cases denatured alcohol to remove the ink.
I hope this helps,
- March 29, 2016 at 2:47 pm #26556Larry GibsonParticipant
- Posts: 55
- Comments: 507
- Overall: 562
I’ve been doing some 30 XCB load development for my M1903 NM ’06. I found with 4895 (IMR and H) that by the time I got the powder burning efficiently the velocity had the bullet over the RPM Threshold and accuracy was not good. That was even with a 3/4 gr Dacron filler. If you are going to try H4895 I suggest starting at 25 gr, use a Dacron filler (3/4 gr) and work up in 1/2 gr increments or the .3 uber7mm mentions if you want to get technical. I suggest 10 shot groups but 5 shot groups initially will tell you if there is any hope. You will know when enough is enough by the enlargement of the groups……that is if you get any real grouping at all. I use a lot of 4895 (IMR and H) with a lot of cast bullets in many different cartridges. However, with lower weight cast bullets in any cartridge 4895 does not perform well as the bullets just do not have the mass or best performance concerning ignition and consistent powder burn in rifles with 10″ of faster twists. Now with 12″ or slower twists H4895 can be a very good powder as you can push up into 2200 – 2300+ fps and still be under the RPM Threshold. Not so with a 10″ twist ’06.
So far I’ve also tested 5744, 2400 and H4198 in my NM ’06 (24″ barrel with 10″ twist). It appears that 19 or 20 gr Alliant 2400 is the winner. A 3/4 gr Dacron filler is used. Velocity is running 1850 – just over 1900 fps depending on which load. That is just under the RPM Threshold. Accuracy is holding at 1 1/2 – 1 3/4 moa at 100 yards (no scope – aperture rear sight) for 10 shot groups. I have 50 rounds of each load to shoot 20 shot groups at 200 and 300 yards (for match shooting on 600 yard reduced targets) as a final test/selection of the load. You might consider testing with 5744, A2400, 4227 or H4198. Rl7 may also be a good choice but I’ve not tested it.
Target shows last 3 test groups of the 19 & 20 gr A2400. (18 gr top, 19 gr middle and bottom) I adjusted the sights for the last 19 gr group. It was shot on a 50 yard pistol target at 100 yards. Overlaid onto a 100 yd reduced 600 yard target it would have scored a 99 with 6 Xs. Your M70 ’06 should do better, especially with a scope as my eyes aren’t as good looking through aperture sights as they once were.
BTW; the Winchester & US Repeating Arms M70 triggers can be adjusted down to 3 lbs w/o much difficulty if you know what you’re doing. If not have someone who does know how adjust the trigger. If they really know what they’re doing they can adjust it lower if you want. My M70 targets rifles trigger breaks very clean at 18 ounces and is 100% reliable.
- March 29, 2016 at 4:38 pm #26563
Well guess I’ll have to re-think this. I do have 1+lb of 2400. Will have to see what’s available for powder on way home. I might be better off going to a heavier bullet as mentioned and save the hard work I put into the 30XCB for my .308 Sav.Model12,. I want to see what I can do with jacketed first with it.
- March 30, 2016 at 2:46 am #26589GRUMPAParticipant
- Posts: 12
- Comments: 20
- Overall: 32
It took me about 2yrs off and on to figure my 98 in 06. Thing was I found out about a year into figuring it out with cast is the type of powder it liked. Trust me there’s a bunch of different types for cast boolits and rifles and if I didn’t go through at least a dozen I would be surprised. Finding the right speed and powder combination for me was the tricky part. Now that I can get 1″ groups all day long it now sits in the cabinet.
I got a new NOE mould for it, the 220gr that I have yet to cast out. Funny how things work, I got about 3K jacketed bullets from a guy for .10ea shipped. All Hornady 165gr match bullets and when I had it set up for jacketed it would hit the prickly pear fruits from 150yds on all day long if I rested the rifle and took my time.
1 of these days I’ll get around to casting some of those NOE 220gr but when I have no clue. But the way I see it so long as I have a supply of lead I can roll my own and not worry about it. Always have this little voice in my head telling me j-words might not be affordable all the time so figure a way to supply your own projectiles.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.