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    • #25772
      Beagle333
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      Got my new Josey Wales 1861 today from Traditions. I like it! The colors are nice, the wood fit is the best I have seen and the action seems very smooth and timed right.
      I think it’s a shooter, right out of the box. πŸ™‚ They had them on sale last week for $338 and I couldn’t resist.

    • #25773
      VANN
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      Very nice.

    • #25786
      Goodsteel
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      That is one fine pistol!
      Don’t ever shoot Pyrodex in it. Use only real black powder, keep it greased, and you’ll be able to pass that to your grand children. Very very nice!

    • #25790
      Beagle333
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      Thanks fellows. I have 3# of Graf’s 3F on the way, and a .380 mold.
      I got about a dozen .44s but never had a .36 before. 😎

    • #25792
      Goodsteel
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      The 36 was supposed to be the cream of cream. I’ve never shot one either, but I’ll bet there’s a very good reason it has survived the annals of history so long.

    • #25797
      Harter
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      I hope you didn’t go with a Lee mould I have 2 of them in 375 and they don’t close the camber if you don’t get them straight up and down . I guess it is the tangible cut off that leaves no sprue nub but it left the balls at .365x 375×375 . I just can’t warm up to the Colts . They look good ,feel good , point well, but something just goes not to ok for me in that place between the hammer locking back and the groups .

      I like the C&B pistols the horde currently houses a 36 and 44 Remington and a 60 that needs a couple of parts . I enjoy shooting them and find them to be as good as the CF sisters with due care. I was surprised to see dimples in 1/4″plate at 25yd from the 36 Remington . So they were and still are a formidable tool .

    • #25799
      Smoke4320
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      Goodsteel;n4213 wrote: That is one fine pistol!
      Don’t ever shoot Pyrodex in it. Use only real black powder, keep it greased, and you’ll be able to pass that to your grand children. Very very nice!

      Don’t ever shoot Pyrodex in it ..explain please? unedjumacated on BP Revolvers

    • #25806
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      It’s a different kind of dirty . It’s hard to explain. In open burn BP leaves a soft thin soot Pyro is less sooty but harder and 777 os just hard white scale. Pyro and 777 are slightly more energetic. They are also just as corrosive but for different reasons that I lack the chemistry skills to describe intelligently.
      In short the subs make harder carbon that’s harder to get clean while BP is softer. ,being softer it will wash out while the others have to be scrubbed and protected even out here in the desert while hot water will clean up and stay for weeks w/o oil . .

      Pyro and 777 pellets functionaly leave something to be desired as well as the crush to clear any airspace. . Theread is also some just plain old prejudice against the sugar based black but not black powder. .
      Having shot all 3 777 is for those that need to get the most out of every bang ,Pyro is what you shoot if BP is unobtainable, and lord the deck hosing that can go on about BP brands ……..it’s like shooting Unique because it works in everything but some folks need H110. ..
      Down in do yourself there is a good link fortified guide to ownself BP .case I can’t get Holy Black off the shelf here and $7/for the 3rd lot is way better than the $24 for the fake stuff . In the end it’s about what works for you and how much you’re willing to spend vs how much work you want to do.

    • #25808
      Beagle333
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      I did get some, but I had to order it from Grafs. Nobody sells it anywhere around and the one place that I did find it a distance away wanted more for it per can than I paid per can for only 5# of it shipped + hazmat.

    • #25816
      Goodsteel
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      Pyrodex residue is hygroscopic and is very similar to corosive primed military ball ammo……..except it never quits. Once a gun has been fired with Pyrodex, the battle against epic orange rust is on for the duration. You’ll never get it to stop.

      I did a side by side test of Pyrodex vs. Goex, and what I found was enough to convince me to NEVER touch that stuff again. It’s a decent propellant, but the damage to the firearms just isn’t worth it.
      Ye be warned.

    • #25853
      Beagle333
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      Mold came today, and you were right Harter…. the sprue does cut off a tangent and leave it short on that side. Too bad I had already ordered it before your post. I always load mine sprue-up anyway though, so it’ll be annoying, but okay.

    • #25867
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      Just a suggestion for safety also for extended shooting sessions I like an 1/8 felt wad damp in olive oil. It is extra insurance against a chain fire . I’ve used bore butter ,crisco and olive-bee in front of the ball the first 2 tend to run as it warms up . In my experience it doesn’t “all blow out and just make a mess”with full cylinders. Lithium grease on the arbor will help for long sessions. To date my longest set was is 16 reloads at a Rondy meet in Missouri. ….could have been 18 ……. in any event it far surpassed my first outing when I had binding by the 8th shot and had to force manual cylinder rotation after the 9th shot. The 1st day there was probably in the neighborhood of 1200 shots fired in 58′ s and 60’s with 6 chaing/multiple chamber discharges .
      This discussion of cousins leads to the “cap or ball end ” dispute ….er….debate. personally tight caps for your pistol and greased mouths will prevent 99.91111% of the possible chain fires . Generally if the ball shaves or at least rolls an edge all the way around will make a mouth flash nil. Tight caps will stop the breach chains , caps can lift if they don’t fit tight .

      1 last bit of wit….wisdom that seems counter productive. I have a 44 that slugs 429×420 ,I matched all 6 chambers to 448 without any problems and eliminated the 2 up there 2 over there and 2 on tagger ,now there is just 1 wanderer and I’m pretty sure it’s my fault . Take your chamfer tool and break the edge of the cylinder mouth ,a VLD style tool works best leave no more than a full visible line ,.005 by eye should be considered an absolute maximum opps. It will make loading much easier and eliminate the rings even with 454s in a 448 chamber..

      Check out goons gun works if you find it to grit and in need of tuning.

    • #25904
      Wheel Gun
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      Nicely done! I’ve only shot BP a couple times but for some reason never owned one however I can picture Clint loading that thing. I must have watched some of his movies 30 times.
      WG

    • #25939
      JeffG
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      Pyrodex P just never worked well for me, or any Pyrodex for that matter in any of my BP guns. BP was always more consistent in ignition, particularly on my Navy Arms 1860 Army kit. I had a friend though that used it all the time in his TC Renegaade but I grew away from it quickly and never went back. Once I got a load that works in the BP arms I have, I stuck with it.

      The wood on that revolver is beautiful.

    • #31743
      Anonymous
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      I just ordered an Uberti 1847 Walker, reading and re reading this entire forum I have gleaned a wealth of information.

      Thank you kind sirs!!

    • #31746
      Goodsteel
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      Congratulations Claude. That’s going to be a very fun revolver to play with! Do head my advice and use only real black powder, and keep it greased.

    • #31755
      Anonymous
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      Not to overshadow any of the other information available here, but the admonition against anything other than real black powder shined. This was the first place I had ever heard of the drawbacks of pyrodex.

      After reading this post a few days ago, the first question I asked the seller was , has it been fired with anything other than true black powder? Had he mentioned pyrodex, I would have passed on the deal.

    • #31756
      Harter
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      Pyrodex , T7, etc require better cleaning and storage prep than real black because they hold more water . Pyro is also hotter than BP and 777 is a little more so . If you’re not the meticulous dress the deer , boil water in the creek , Hopes in the day pack guy or shooting SS guns then the advice is sound . More so in the wet country .

    • #31938
      Anonymous
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      keep it greased,

      My Walker arrived today and I an uncertain what type grease is called for here, I have read a good deal and many times there is an admonition to stay away from petroleum based grease. After much searching I am unsure whether that applies to lubing the cylinder spindle, or just lube that will be in contact with powder.

      Any advice is welcome

    • #31952
      uber7mm
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      Great advise on powder selection. I’ve used Pyrodex, but afterwards I boiled my pistol, sans wood grips in home made moose milk. (Equal parts water pump lubricant and water, IIRC). Took about 2 hours of meticulous scrubbing to get the thing clean. Shelved that one because smokeless cast is so much easier. Might give BP a try. Those Cap ‘n Ball &Flint guns have such a cool look to them.

    • #31955
      Rattlesnake Charlie
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      Uneven sprue from Lee molds?
      Shoot them and see how they do.
      I think you’ll be surprised how well they do.

    • #31966
      Goodsteel
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      Just a word on chain fires:
      Like Harter said, its a hotly debated subject, but my opinion is based on personal experiance. My first personally bought and paid for firearm was a Confederate Navy 1851 brass framed revolver bought from Cabellas for $74.99 with the kit. Just like this one here:
      http://www.cabelas.com/product/Pietta-Model-Confederate-Navy-Caliber-Black-Powder-Revolver/740536.uts

      I shot three cylinders out of that baby every day on lunch break and carried it on my hip constantly (benefits of being home schooled by pro-gun parents).
      Anyway, I ran out of bore butter and those felt wads, pretty fast, but I just kept shooting.
      Needles to say, chain fires were common. I’ve experienced dozens of them. My under developed frontal lobe prevented me from seeing any danger, and I never got hurt.
      I cast my balls out of pure lead using a Lee mold, and when seated, they left s ring of lead on top of the cylinder. I used any propellant I could find, and shot Goex and Pyrodex interchangeably.
      I used no lube for a while there, and accuracy fell off about the time the cylinder got stiff, and I didn’t think anything of scrubbing the lead out of the barrel. I was young, curious, and hungry for experience (but I digress).
      The point is, I had many chainfires and I thought it was a curious occurance. I watched for them to happen and I investigated. What o found was often the case was an empty chamber adjacent to the one that sent a ball down the barrel.
      Often the cap was missing from the nipple, but just as often, the cap was still in place…..and it was still alive. I could thumb the hammer again and pop it. I witnessed this many times and it frustrated me. I decided to read up on this phenomenon, and see if I could discover how the fire got past a hermetic seal between lead and steel.
      I never found an answer, but I did find recommendations that greasing over the bullets would stop the chain fires, and it did. I started smearing crisco over the cylinderthroats, and the problems went away, to say nothing of the fact that leading was drastically reduced, and I also got more shots before it got stiff to thumb the hammer back.
      I took to greasing the cylinder pin too which helped. I found a source for borebutter and I used it as advertised as a grease, and a bullet lube. I smeared it in a cloth and buffed the steel parts to keep it preserved. It’s my opinion that your grease is the stuff that makes the gun run reliably, and I even put it on the screw threads and the cross bolt.
      (So to Claude: that’s what I meant when I said to keep it greased.)
      Back to the discussion on chainfires, because of this experiance, I am convinced that chainfires happen from the FRONT of the cylinder. Even after years of Gunsmithing, I cannot understand how this happens, but the evidence is irrefutable. Unbroken caps coupled with better results via a flame retardant plug over the front end of the cylinder, pretty much negates chainfires happening from the rear end of the cylinder IMHO.

      Regardless, I’m sure that there are better alternatives for grease available now days, but for me, Borebutter doubled my pleasure and doubled my fun. I wound up thinking more of that product than I did of the powder and ball.
      If you’re going to shoot black powder shoot REAL black powder, and above all: Mind your grease.

    • #31967
      WCM
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      “You see there Liage ,you pull his teeth ,he’s harmless as a heel hound.”

    • #31968
      Goodsteel
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      Beagle333;n4198 wrote:

      I do not recognize that screw on the RHof the frame above the trigger guard. What is that?

    • #31969
      uber7mm
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      Use a non-petroleum based grease for your cylinder. Vasoline becomes a black tar when shot in conjunction with Black Powder/Pyrodex. An old shooting buddy used to use it. Talk about a mess to clean up. However, when his gun was so crusty and fouled that he had to rotate the cylinder by hand, he said the pistol was dead on.

      There was an article years back on how to make paper cartridges for a Cap’n Ball revolver. I had it saved on my PC until it crashed and I lost everything. Has anyone experimented with paper cartridges?

    • #31972
      Goodsteel
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      One more thing I might add: the pistols that Clint Eastwood carried on his hips in the movey Josey Wales were 1847 Colt Walker replicas (which looks really awesome on film, but is a historical train wreck unless he had a couple buddies from the Texas Rangers who died and left them to him).
      He also carried the Colt 1860 Army 44 caliber in a cross draw holster.
      In most of the scenes, he uses the monstrous Walker pistols (one of which was the scene in the trading post where he did the border roll. Seriously. Any hombre that can pull off a perfect border roll with 1847 Walkers while the cameras are rolling and do it fast has hands of steel and balls of solid brass).
      The scene where the bounty hunters caught up with him and his gut shot partner, Wales is disarmed and gets the drop on them with an 1849 Colt Army 36 caliber pocket revolver that looks positively tiny compared to the Walkers used in other scenes.
      The 1860 was the more historically likely revolver that a guerrilla fighter would have used, so the OP chose well.
      In the book, its reported that he had four more of these 44 caliber pistols holstered to his saddle. The fighting style used (in the book at least) was to hit the enemy extremely hard at close range in a surprise attack and just keep on riding. Very dangerous work because these tacktics were considered cowardly, and perpetrators were outlaws (that’s why they were gunned down like rats when they surrendered. There was quite a bit of hate towards guerrilla fighters because they hit hard when the enemy was unprepared to respond. (Now days this just sounds like real warfare).
      The point is, for the guerrilla fighter, running out of ammo was a really bad thing. They needed every oportinity to shoot their way out of the fights they initiated and get to safety without stopping to reload, and when it came to rapid fire and hard hitting at close range, the 1860 Army 44 was unparalleled at that time.

    • #31973
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      Personally no not yet .

      Curler papers from the various beauty supply stores are regarded as the next best thing to nitrided paper . Tea bag material can also be used with no need to punctue the cartridge .

      A mandrill tool is needed to form a tapered about 2 cal smaller od than the arm to ball dia . Roll the paper tube and close the base . Technique departs at this point with the particular need and paper choice. Some form and seal a flat base others fold a tail up . It also varies by intent of the loader and if they intend to use the paper as a cartridge or as wadding .
      The cartridge is charged ,an over powder card or dry wad placed , then an inert lube cookie or wad then the ball . Again there is a choice of methods here as the powder card may be omitted and a separately wrapped ball and lube be placed in the tube . This choice is again based on paper and intent . Some makers will at this point tie the cartridge to the ball while others will fold and glue over the ball.

      Simple fast loading with modern tricks that reflect the history all the way to 1851 mill rolled bite ,pour ,stuff and ram , the general over simplified lay out is above.

    • #31974
      doc1876
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      Sholder stock anchor. Notice the cutout on the reciol shield. Same thing.

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